Too Many Transmission Filters
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Too Many Transmission Filters
I’m Looking for some guidance on replacing the transmission filter in my 2014 Camry, U760E transmission. I see names like Transmaxx, PA Cargo, ATP, Beck/Arnley, Toyota, PowerTorque and so on with prices from $10- to $75- and most being maybe $20 to $35-. Seems like a big spread. Does anybody have any guidance on what to use? I don’t want to drop the pan because I made the wrong choice on the filter!
Last edited by tweakit; May 4, 2018 at 11:48 PM. Reason: correct transmission code
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From: PTW
What engine, 4-cylinder or V-6?
Toyota parts are always excellent. For aftermarket suggest Wix.
The $75 filter is too much! Is this Transmaxx? Transmaxx has a lower priced filter.
Beck/Arnley typically sells good parts.
Some DIY'ers like ATP but never used them.
If a preference, check pan gasket as some are cork and others rubber.
Toyota parts are always excellent. For aftermarket suggest Wix.
The $75 filter is too much! Is this Transmaxx? Transmaxx has a lower priced filter.
Beck/Arnley typically sells good parts.
Some DIY'ers like ATP but never used them.
If a preference, check pan gasket as some are cork and others rubber.
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Next question: Aisin WS fluid
Thanks for this information. Very helpful.
Mine is the 4-cyl 2AR-FE which I think means the U760E transmission.
Here is a new question about what ATF fluid to use. I have always gone with the OEM licensed fluid but AFAIK Toyota doesn't license their WS fluid. Aisin, who I've heard makes the U760E transmission sells their own ATF-WS fluid and the cost delta is tempting! About a $35- difference on 9 quarts (2 spares). While the Aisin fluid does not appear to be made under any license it also does not appear to be just another multi-vehicle fluid either. Has anyone used the Aisin ATF-WS in a Toyota transmission? Results? Comments?
Mine is the 4-cyl 2AR-FE which I think means the U760E transmission.
Here is a new question about what ATF fluid to use. I have always gone with the OEM licensed fluid but AFAIK Toyota doesn't license their WS fluid. Aisin, who I've heard makes the U760E transmission sells their own ATF-WS fluid and the cost delta is tempting! About a $35- difference on 9 quarts (2 spares). While the Aisin fluid does not appear to be made under any license it also does not appear to be just another multi-vehicle fluid either. Has anyone used the Aisin ATF-WS in a Toyota transmission? Results? Comments?
Last edited by tweakit; May 4, 2018 at 04:44 PM. Reason: correct transmission code
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Back to transmission filters
A lot of people doing maintenance on Camrys install external in-line Magnafine filters. These filters have both a fabric and a magnet inside. Of course, the transmission has both of these already, so it’s not clear to me why I would double up on the filter. I’m thinking about not bothering with the Magnafine addition. Instead maybe just buying some magnets and adding them in the pan! Any thoughts??
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From: PTW
The side of the drivers side door may have a sticker indicating the trans model.
Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc seems to the most used substitute. Valvoline lists it for WS.
Aisin Type WS is also listed for Toyota low viscosity fluid which WS is.
Both are synthetic.
Toyota owns 20+ percent of Aisin. Some state Aisin and Toyota source the same maker for their WS ATF.
Typically a pan will have factory magnets. The trans model ATF filter seems to be something more then just a screen as in real media filter.
If concerned about filtering AFT, look into can type filters. The filter screws onto an adapter. Check reviews as some at better then others in the quality of adapter castings.
Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc seems to the most used substitute. Valvoline lists it for WS.
Aisin Type WS is also listed for Toyota low viscosity fluid which WS is.
Both are synthetic.
Toyota owns 20+ percent of Aisin. Some state Aisin and Toyota source the same maker for their WS ATF.
Typically a pan will have factory magnets. The trans model ATF filter seems to be something more then just a screen as in real media filter.
If concerned about filtering AFT, look into can type filters. The filter screws onto an adapter. Check reviews as some at better then others in the quality of adapter castings.
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Thank you. Why do you think Aisin ATF WS is synthetic? I have not seen anything on the bottle or on their website to indicate it is synthetic. Same thing for Toyota WS. I haven't seen Toyota say anywhere that theirs is synthetic either. Just curious as to why you think it is synthetic? Maybe do you think it is a synthetic blend?
Thank you for your help.
Thank you for your help.
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From: PTW
Good point.
Aisin states their fluid is interchangeable with Toyota WS, as such it's as good (or bad) as Toyota WS.
Toyota claim WS is a "lifetime" fluid. Their service bulletins state the fluid has a 100K maintenance interval. A standard ATF cannot achieve this.
Toyota WS ATF reaches a new low in viscosity for Toyota. One typically can't get this (0W) in trans or motor oils without going synthetic.
Totachi (makes chemicals) states their "synthetic low viscosity" ATF is specifically designed for Toyota and Lexus cars equipped with the latest gen of Aisin-Warner trans. Totachi calls their fluid ATF WS.
Toyota lists WS ATF as "TOYOTA WS ATF JWS 3324 NWS 9638." Researching on JWS 3324 NWS 9638, one starts going here and there. Various companies such as Totachi and Aisin list JWS 3324 spec interchangeable fluids.
Some DIYer's state WS is not synthetic based on the fact the MSDS states its main component is mineral oil and the flash point is too low. Some makers use HC/HT hydrocracked oils which is mineral oil to make their synthetic. Synthetic flash point can be the same as mineral oil.
One can go round and round here. Unfortunately Toyota never comes clean in it stating what the WS fluid is.
However the term "WS" is not something Toyota came up with. Other companies make what they call a WS fluid and some of them state its synthetic while others are mute.
Aisin and Totachi sell WS fluid. Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc (states it is a synthetic) has been used successfully.
The above isn't a direct link to stating Toyota WS is synthetic.
Toyota is either working hard to be clever in pitching something that is not synthetic as such, or the fluid is something other the typically ATF.
Speculate Toyota WS is at least a blend if not a synthetic.
This stated Toyota appears to have redefined "life time" fluid as the life of the trans. And apparently cut back their recommended change period? Maxlife (a synthetic) is marketed as a 75K fluid.
This stated Toyota has always stated to monitor their WS fluid and compare its color to a dealer color chart to determine its condition. It appears some DIYer's skip over this fact and go directly to a criticism of the term "life time."
Aisin states their fluid is interchangeable with Toyota WS, as such it's as good (or bad) as Toyota WS.
Toyota claim WS is a "lifetime" fluid. Their service bulletins state the fluid has a 100K maintenance interval. A standard ATF cannot achieve this.
Toyota WS ATF reaches a new low in viscosity for Toyota. One typically can't get this (0W) in trans or motor oils without going synthetic.
Totachi (makes chemicals) states their "synthetic low viscosity" ATF is specifically designed for Toyota and Lexus cars equipped with the latest gen of Aisin-Warner trans. Totachi calls their fluid ATF WS.
Toyota lists WS ATF as "TOYOTA WS ATF JWS 3324 NWS 9638." Researching on JWS 3324 NWS 9638, one starts going here and there. Various companies such as Totachi and Aisin list JWS 3324 spec interchangeable fluids.
Some DIYer's state WS is not synthetic based on the fact the MSDS states its main component is mineral oil and the flash point is too low. Some makers use HC/HT hydrocracked oils which is mineral oil to make their synthetic. Synthetic flash point can be the same as mineral oil.
One can go round and round here. Unfortunately Toyota never comes clean in it stating what the WS fluid is.
However the term "WS" is not something Toyota came up with. Other companies make what they call a WS fluid and some of them state its synthetic while others are mute.
Aisin and Totachi sell WS fluid. Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc (states it is a synthetic) has been used successfully.
The above isn't a direct link to stating Toyota WS is synthetic.
Toyota is either working hard to be clever in pitching something that is not synthetic as such, or the fluid is something other the typically ATF.
Speculate Toyota WS is at least a blend if not a synthetic.
This stated Toyota appears to have redefined "life time" fluid as the life of the trans. And apparently cut back their recommended change period? Maxlife (a synthetic) is marketed as a 75K fluid.
This stated Toyota has always stated to monitor their WS fluid and compare its color to a dealer color chart to determine its condition. It appears some DIYer's skip over this fact and go directly to a criticism of the term "life time."
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Thank you for taking the time to provide such a thorough and informative response to my question. A few questions in response to your reply above…
You said: “Toyota lists WS ATF as "TOYOTA WS ATF JWS 3324 NWS 9638."
Where did you see this? I would like to read that. Did Toyota also approve fluids compliant with JWS3324 for use in Toyota cars requiring Genuine Toyota ATF WS? My car manual and my local dealer both say to use only Genuine Toyota ATF WS. Also, I have never seen where Toyota has made known a public domain specification which defines the requirements of Genuine Toyota ATF WS. If I’m missing something I would like to know where Toyota has made this known.
You said: “Unfortunately Toyota never comes clean in it stating what the WS fluid is. ”
Yes, this has long been my understanding. This is consistent with not licensing anyone to make the same fluid or approving any alternative fluid. Its proprietary and the formulation belongs to Toyota and is under wraps so to speak. That said, I’ve never understood why Toyota did not copywrite or otherwise protect the name ATF WS given that they want to be the sole source of this fluid for their customers. If that name was in the public domain then it makes no sense that Toyota did not come up with a new name and copywrite it so that it would be clear to their customers that they can only get the right fluid from Toyota. I find the whole thing rather confusing. Thanks again for your help.
You said: “Toyota lists WS ATF as "TOYOTA WS ATF JWS 3324 NWS 9638."
Where did you see this? I would like to read that. Did Toyota also approve fluids compliant with JWS3324 for use in Toyota cars requiring Genuine Toyota ATF WS? My car manual and my local dealer both say to use only Genuine Toyota ATF WS. Also, I have never seen where Toyota has made known a public domain specification which defines the requirements of Genuine Toyota ATF WS. If I’m missing something I would like to know where Toyota has made this known.
You said: “Unfortunately Toyota never comes clean in it stating what the WS fluid is. ”
Yes, this has long been my understanding. This is consistent with not licensing anyone to make the same fluid or approving any alternative fluid. Its proprietary and the formulation belongs to Toyota and is under wraps so to speak. That said, I’ve never understood why Toyota did not copywrite or otherwise protect the name ATF WS given that they want to be the sole source of this fluid for their customers. If that name was in the public domain then it makes no sense that Toyota did not come up with a new name and copywrite it so that it would be clear to their customers that they can only get the right fluid from Toyota. I find the whole thing rather confusing. Thanks again for your help.
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From: PTW
Don't think you are missing anything. This subject is most confusing and facts few and far between.
The analogy was based on antidotal evidence. Auto makers do keep these kind of things internal. Dealers and DIYer's may be more candid in the products they use to service Toyota vehicles.
It doesn't appear Toyota has approved any substitute ATF fluids for Toyota WS. In the olden days the Toyota owner's manual fluid listings might have stated to use Toyota ABC or "equivalent."
Toyota may be trying to make more money by selling their products over suitable substitutes or to maintain a vehicles EPA MPG criteria it was certified to or ?
There is no incentive for them to spec an aftermarket fluid when they have their own product. This stated, it has happened a dealer might use products other then the car makers brand.
The trend has been for vehicle auto trans to use less viscous ATF to increase MPG which a synthetic can provide. A natural benefit of synthetic is longer life trans ATF life to lower maintenance intervals (pleases customers) and a company appearing to be more eco friendly (less used ATF fluid).
Toyota may have developed their trans for what was a WS ATF. Some speculate the ATF was tweaked then branded as Toyota.
When Toyota went to WS, DIYer's were trying to find cheaper alternatives which they appear to have been found. Are they the same, who knows but they do work.
When Toyota came out with Toyota ATF branded as T-IV, again DIYer's were trying to find alternatives. T-IV appears to be a Dexron ? type to replace Dexron III. GM then withdraw all Dexron licenses.
Some speculation was Toyota needed a new ATF source and or no longer wanted to pay licensing fees to GM or ? It appears T-IV was interchangeable or the same as Mobil 3309. However at the time 3309 was not readily available in the US but this has changed. Today there are other ATF fluids that will work.
The point being here Toyota appears to have branded a fluid that may have been something of the shelf, perhaps slightly tweaked.
See link below.
The term WS appears to be a universal acronym and not something Toyota came up with.
https://totachi.com/wp-content/uploa...TDS_ATF_WS.pdf
See link below for an indirect link to these specs.
https://www.google.com/search?
q=aisin+automatic+transmission+fluid+oem+interchan ge&oq=aisin+automatic+transmission+fluid+oem+inter change&aqs=chrome..69i57.49786j0j4&sourceid=chrome &ie=UTF-8
Once here click "[PDF]Automatic Transmission Fluid OEM Interchange - iPd"
You should be at a Aisin "Automatic Transmission OEM Interchange."
The last line of the Aisin OEM interchange reads:
Lexus, Toyota. Scion: Toyota Genuine ATF WS (JWS3324 or NWS9638)
Speculate given a host of vehicle makers have gone to trans which use a WS type fluid. Toyota WS is just another WS fluid among WS fluids.
Again no definitive proof one fluid is the same as another.
But to your real question. Can you use some other product besides Toyota WS in a trans stated to use only Toyota WS? Would state yes.
Would use Aisin WS or Totachi WS (if one can find it in the US) or try Maxlife. Unfortunately ATF fluid types available in the US are not the same as in other parts of the world.
If you do go with Toyota WS do an in depth net search for lowest prices. Try Ebay which has something around $8 quart plus shipping. Check with your local Toyota dealer as some DIYer's state they have been given almost decent prices on WS.
Read up on the ATF change process as Toyota specifies the fluid needs to be at XX temp when checked.
The analogy was based on antidotal evidence. Auto makers do keep these kind of things internal. Dealers and DIYer's may be more candid in the products they use to service Toyota vehicles.
It doesn't appear Toyota has approved any substitute ATF fluids for Toyota WS. In the olden days the Toyota owner's manual fluid listings might have stated to use Toyota ABC or "equivalent."
Toyota may be trying to make more money by selling their products over suitable substitutes or to maintain a vehicles EPA MPG criteria it was certified to or ?
There is no incentive for them to spec an aftermarket fluid when they have their own product. This stated, it has happened a dealer might use products other then the car makers brand.
The trend has been for vehicle auto trans to use less viscous ATF to increase MPG which a synthetic can provide. A natural benefit of synthetic is longer life trans ATF life to lower maintenance intervals (pleases customers) and a company appearing to be more eco friendly (less used ATF fluid).
Toyota may have developed their trans for what was a WS ATF. Some speculate the ATF was tweaked then branded as Toyota.
When Toyota went to WS, DIYer's were trying to find cheaper alternatives which they appear to have been found. Are they the same, who knows but they do work.
When Toyota came out with Toyota ATF branded as T-IV, again DIYer's were trying to find alternatives. T-IV appears to be a Dexron ? type to replace Dexron III. GM then withdraw all Dexron licenses.
Some speculation was Toyota needed a new ATF source and or no longer wanted to pay licensing fees to GM or ? It appears T-IV was interchangeable or the same as Mobil 3309. However at the time 3309 was not readily available in the US but this has changed. Today there are other ATF fluids that will work.
The point being here Toyota appears to have branded a fluid that may have been something of the shelf, perhaps slightly tweaked.
See link below.
The term WS appears to be a universal acronym and not something Toyota came up with.
https://totachi.com/wp-content/uploa...TDS_ATF_WS.pdf
See link below for an indirect link to these specs.
https://www.google.com/search?
q=aisin+automatic+transmission+fluid+oem+interchan ge&oq=aisin+automatic+transmission+fluid+oem+inter change&aqs=chrome..69i57.49786j0j4&sourceid=chrome &ie=UTF-8
Once here click "[PDF]Automatic Transmission Fluid OEM Interchange - iPd"
You should be at a Aisin "Automatic Transmission OEM Interchange."
The last line of the Aisin OEM interchange reads:
Lexus, Toyota. Scion: Toyota Genuine ATF WS (JWS3324 or NWS9638)
Speculate given a host of vehicle makers have gone to trans which use a WS type fluid. Toyota WS is just another WS fluid among WS fluids.
Again no definitive proof one fluid is the same as another.
But to your real question. Can you use some other product besides Toyota WS in a trans stated to use only Toyota WS? Would state yes.
Would use Aisin WS or Totachi WS (if one can find it in the US) or try Maxlife. Unfortunately ATF fluid types available in the US are not the same as in other parts of the world.
If you do go with Toyota WS do an in depth net search for lowest prices. Try Ebay which has something around $8 quart plus shipping. Check with your local Toyota dealer as some DIYer's state they have been given almost decent prices on WS.
Read up on the ATF change process as Toyota specifies the fluid needs to be at XX temp when checked.
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Thanks for all this information. You've done a good job of distilling what is known and what is not and what you've said makes good sense to me. I can't find any source for Totachi WS but Aisin WS is available from several sources. The dealers around here are charging $9.50 to $14.50 per quart of Toyota WS. I've done a lot of web reading on the process for changing the fluid and plan to do this with a cooler install once i get all the parts. I've never seen a fluid change process as exacting as the one for my Camry. I hope i don't get cold feet when the parts arrive! If it all works well, I'll let you know how it turned out. Otherwise, I'll do my best to forget it!