I understand what your saying but mechanically speaking that sensor is detecting the position of the distributor AND the camshaft position at the same time because their in synch with eachother. There must be a way to test that sensor within the distributor. I doubt its available seperately but for diag reasons there has to be a test for it.

 

There is a way to test it, by testing the continuity of the pickup coil that is part of the sensor. The pickup coil test I outlined in the previous post tests that sensor. The sensor is just a magnet passing a coil, so if the coil is intact the sensor should be good.

 

well I cleaned up the disty and the plugs and am getting a thin but blue spark consistantly. last time I checked, it was fireing at the right time (about 12* BTDC) so, im hoping this rules out spark. when I pulled the spark plugs, I could smell fuel when cranking and could smell it on the plugs. plus the plugs were fouled so I know they are at least seeing some fuel. I dont think starter fluid would foul a plug. I did try sanding and cleaning up the plugs and reinstalling them. that didnt get the engine to start, but when I crank it now, it wants to start a little more(pops and sputters). and every once and a while, I can get a bigger cough if I use a quick burst of starter fluid. Someone at napa suggested just taking off the ignition controle moduel (ICM) and bringing it in since they can test it for free if they have the right clip as it could be producing a weaker spark. well I brought in the ignitor, since thats all that I could find that resembeled an ICM on this engine (am I just missing it???) and they couldnt test it but could this be my problem. I have a spark that is blue and on time so could the ignitor still be a problem. any ideas for testing it? Well what do you guys think??? could a bad fuel pressure regulator be causing the fuel rail to loose pressure when cranking and just drip the injectors instead of spraying them, causing me to smell fuel but keep it from atomising?

 

From what I've been able to understand in the FSM the ignitor is used to control spark and spark timing and iscontrolled by the ECM. The ignitor seems to be used to turn the primary voltage of the coil on/off to generate secondary high voltage to the plugs. The only test I could find is a voltage check from theECM to the ignitor. Haynes does not even discuss it except totell you how to replace it. If the ignitor was not working I don't think you'dget any spark as there would be no way to control primary on/off in the coil. It also appears that to test the ignitor you need to replace it with a new one.The ECM (ICM)does not regulate how much spark, it just outputs signalsto the ignitorwhich controls the coil which gives you the right amount ofspark voltage.If the ECM is giving output signals, as it appears it is, I think it is OK. I think for now you need to assume you are getting enough spark to ignite fuel. A fuel pressure check now would be useful.

 

I plan to do a fuel pressure check if I can get the propper tools. I have a fuel pressure gauge and Im going to get a fitting that will fit onto the outlet side of the fuel filter so that I can check output from the pump. I know when pumps fail, they usually go out totally but like I said before, Im checking everything. I also need the propper fitting so I can check the pressure on the rail. What kind of fitting do I need for this and where on the rail should I tap into?

I also found a place that will let me buy an ignitor and return it if it doesnt work. so that is soon to come too.

 

I guess you already knowif the pump is operating, just maybe not putting out enough pressure? If not I would first check pump. Connect 12v source to pump terminal. + to terminal 4, - to terminal 5. The connector should have 5 terminals 3 on top, 2 on the bottom. The 3 on top # 1,2,3 left to right. #4 is bottom left, #5 is bottom right.

For pressure check youneed to tap into banjo fitting on fuel filter. You will need a banjo bolt adapterfor your fuel gauge. The gauge banjo mounts on top of the fuel line banjo. The procedure to check fuel pressure is a little extensive to post here so PM me and I'll try to email you a scan of the FSM page describing the procedure. Haynes has a little different procedure but it should work. Haynes also desribes how to make your own banjo adapter if you're up to it.The tap into the fuel rail seems to be a special Toyo tool but the FSM only describes the banjo bolt fitting method.

It may be simpler to tow it to Toyo for the fuel pressure test.

If you have fuel pressure I would just replace the coil. It seems to be the only thing left to do.

 

I agree with this guy...remove the ignition cap and coil cover you mit find a crack on the coil..

 

ok...updates. I pulled off the ignitor to get napa to test it and they could not so im unsure of its status...
But today I put in new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, fuel filter and it started right up and the idel was smooth. BUT- the timing was now at about 3-5* before TDC at idel, shich is weird since it was at about 12* before and I hadnt adjusted the distributer so I have no idea why the timing would change so much. I turned the disty and got it back to ~12* before but the disty is pretty maxed out in that range of adjustment so I am certain that something screwey is going on with the timing. AND... the engine dies at the slightest hint of a load. turned on the AC, it died. turned the wheel which must have ingaged the PS pump and killed the engine again. Now im still confused obviously but doing better now that it will at least start.
I havnt pushed on the gas at idel yet because the batt has a dead cell and I have to get a new one before i can start it up any more.

So here is where I am at. It idels but will die when you ask anything of it. spark was blue but kinda thin before I replaced all the parts so it can only be better now. It probably hasnt jumped a tooth on the T belt because it sounds too good at idel and is too touchy to die. I think that if it had jumped a tooth, it would idel funky but still be drivable. It could be a fuel related problem since I did change the fuel filter and then it got good enough to start, but I did all the replacements at the same time so the same could be true for spark. The spark is pretty strong so I dont think weak spark is the problem but why the hell did the timing change so much. what could have changed the spark timing so much? does the ignitor control spark timing??? well please give me any ideas you have. thanks

 

When you checked/adjusted timing did you put a jumper wire between TE1 and E1 of the diagnostic connector? As I stated on a previous post there is no test for the ignitor. The ignitor does not determine the amount of spark voltage, it just cycles the coil to get voltage. I think your ignitor is OK. I don't completely understand how the ignitor works but according to the FSM it does contribute to engine timing as well as coil operation. If you want to test maybe you could pull one from a junker and replace. I would try advancing the timing and see if the car responds better. Also I would get it to start and spray carb cleaner down the throttle at the same time you increase throttle and see if you can get the RPMs up. I would not use starter fluid is that stuff is really flammable. Be careful of backfire up throttle body, so don't put your face in front.

 

throttle position sensor mit be sticking..